tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post5717761823062570098..comments2024-03-28T06:23:02.679-05:00Comments on Give2Attain: Fix White Liberals Instead of Black Students?Johnhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14991027705809503541noreply@blogger.comBlogger71125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-16940319154506154182015-03-03T11:26:47.111-06:002015-03-03T11:26:47.111-06:00Reconstitution
Resconstitution 2<a href="http://www.wested.org/online_pubs/state_intervention/Reconstitution.html" rel="nofollow">Reconstitution</a><br /><br /><a href="http://dbacon.igc.org/Work/02recnst.htm" rel="nofollow">Resconstitution 2</a>Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14991027705809503541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-74833585046834318402015-03-03T08:54:09.324-06:002015-03-03T08:54:09.324-06:00http://www.wested.org/online_pubs/state_interventi...http://www.wested.org/online_pubs/state_intervention/Reconstitution.html<br /><br />And this one seems to thread the needle nicely.<br /><br />http://dbacon.igc.org/Work/02recnst.htmjerrye92002https://www.blogger.com/profile/01858692298982859775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-84332236956137213262015-03-03T08:37:11.985-06:002015-03-03T08:37:11.985-06:00PMFBI, but I think both of you are missing two thi...PMFBI, but I think both of you are missing two things: First, I think a lot of teachers who can, just like the students who would if they could, leave the "challenging" (sounds better than "failing") schools for fears about their personal SAFETY. Survival trumps pay. Second would be the frustration that must come from being tossed into a situation where you don't have the control necessary to make it better. You're bound by the rules, the structure, the lack of expectations all around you. Fix those things and THEN I think pay would matter. <br /><br />This is all difficult to impossible, of course, which is why I think reconstituting the school may be the quickest and most effective approach.jerrye92002https://www.blogger.com/profile/01858692298982859775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-28342115148064019272015-03-02T22:04:35.194-06:002015-03-02T22:04:35.194-06:00Yes I think if we really want to get serious about...Yes I think if we really want to get serious about helping the unlucky kids, closing the achievement gap and eliminating poverty, we need to change things so that the most capable Teachers are encouraged to and rewarded for working with these children. <br /><br />The current system rewards Teachers for longevity, not for capability or helping the students who need it most. <br /><br />And it frustrates the efforts of Administrators who are trying to do their best to put the most effective Teachers where they are most needed. And it makes the removal of poor performers much too difficult and time consuming.<br /><br />The strange choices we make as a society....Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14991027705809503541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-25641790653986050472015-03-02T19:25:10.187-06:002015-03-02T19:25:10.187-06:00"I would like the Principals helping the good..."I would like the Principals helping the good Teachers and the students, not struggling to evict a poor Teacher."<br /><br />Well, if it's important, you do the right thing for the students.<br /><br />"I looked back through the comments and could not find where you gave reasonable cost neutral ideas that would ensure the most capable Teachers in a District were placed in the most challenging schools."<br /><br />So you're suggesting we cut pay for teachers in less challenging schools?Seanhttp://brickcityblog.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-21420366198855557002015-03-02T17:07:07.472-06:002015-03-02T17:07:07.472-06:00Public Employment Labor Relations
Contract Rules
...<a href="https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/?id=179A" rel="nofollow">Public Employment Labor Relations</a><br /><br /><a href="https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/?id=122A.40" rel="nofollow">Contract Rules</a><br /><br />Those procedures to get rid of poor Teachers are time consuming, expensive, open to law suits, etc. During that whole period the Teachers often stay in the classroom. I would like the Principals helping the good Teachers and the students, not struggling to evict a poor Teacher.<br /><br />I looked back through the comments and could not find where you gave reasonable cost neutral ideas that would ensure the most capable Teachers in a District were placed in the most challenging schools.<br /><br />All I saw was more training, more money for Teachers in those schools, some other trade off, etc. All of these would require budget increases. Please remember that the Mpls District tried to make lots of positive changes for the kids. Just to be shot down by the Union.<br /><br />Please remember that the Union is there to maximize income, benefits, job security, etc for their more powerful members. It is not their to maximize the benefit for the poor students who attend the schools.<br /><br />Thankfully my children have my wife and I to advocate for them. Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14991027705809503541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-78857051004542840672015-03-02T14:31:27.595-06:002015-03-02T14:31:27.595-06:00State law also sharply prohibits the ability of te...State law also sharply prohibits the ability of teachers to strike. In fact, there hasn't been a teachers strike in the state since 2005. Seanhttp://brickcityblog.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-67939735805273019462015-03-02T14:17:39.176-06:002015-03-02T14:17:39.176-06:00" what would you offer the Teachers to encour..." what would you offer the Teachers to encourage them to send their best Teachers to the schools with the students that need them the most?"<br /><br />I've already addressed this.<br /><br />"How would you encourage them to police themselves to ensure incompetent or burnt out Teachers are removed from MN K-12 education and the classroms of our children?"<br /><br />That is the job of the administration. Procedures to get rid of incompetent teachers already exist, it should be pointed out. It's just up to the administration to follow them.Seanhttp://brickcityblog.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-39914929814857149252015-03-02T13:39:29.461-06:002015-03-02T13:39:29.461-06:00Assuming the yearly total funding invested in the ...Assuming the yearly total funding invested in the MN K-12 schools is adequate, what would you offer the Teachers to encourage them to send their best Teachers to the schools with the students that need them the most?<br /><br />How would you encourage them to police themselves to ensure incompetent or burnt out Teachers are removed from MN K-12 education and the classroms of our children?Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14991027705809503541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-79250107356461425412015-03-02T13:34:32.089-06:002015-03-02T13:34:32.089-06:00"School Boards insist"... Now you must ..."School Boards insist"... Now you must be joking... Ed MN has most of the leverage and the current system rewards those in power at Ed MN. (ie Older teachers) I mean when the Union chooses to strike during the school year, the boards are forced to capitualte.<br /><br />Please remember that Private companies fail when the Union demands make the company too ineffective, inefficient and non-competitive. Whereas it is the unlucky students who suffer most when the Union demands make the company too ineffective, inefficient and non-competitive. <br /><br />The funds are are not allowed to go to a competitor, they simply become poorly allocated, productivity is decreases and the poor kids get left behind.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14991027705809503541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-48426486738694119012015-03-02T11:54:08.117-06:002015-03-02T11:54:08.117-06:00I don't disagree that districts should be able...I don't disagree that districts should be able to pay higher salaries in poorer-performing schools. What's stopping this from occurring? School boards that don't insist on this in their negotiations with unions, and their failure to provide some other sort of provisions that would encourage the unions to make the tradeoff.Seanhttp://brickcityblog.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-20778598851809503352015-03-02T11:46:22.119-06:002015-03-02T11:46:22.119-06:00Everything is relative. And most people are simila...Everything is relative. And most people are similar. People typically are motivated by extrinsic and intrinsic factors.<br />People typically want a chance to receive higher rewards (ie financial or other) if they are going to be required to expend extra effort or if they will be exposed to higher risk.<br /><br />Teaching in poor schools where long hours are likely and the risk of failure/burnout is high should justify higher compensation and performance bonuses. Instead, those who are guaranteed higher compensation and lower risk are given the freedom to choose schools with an easier student body. <br /><br />The impact of the comp policy is terrible for the kids who need excellent Teachers the most.<br /><br />What would be great for those kids would be if Teaching positions in the failing schools had the highest compensation and bonuses that were tied directly to student achievement?<br /><br />Of course I don't think the Teachers in Wayzata would be happy to see their comp cut to offset the extra costs.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14991027705809503541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-41720931315145589612015-03-02T08:46:41.816-06:002015-03-02T08:46:41.816-06:00"I your perception of reality, who chooses to..."I your perception of reality, who chooses to take the risk to start a small business when the odds are that it will fail within 5 years?"<br /><br />Or maybe teachers have different motivations than entrepreneurs.Seanhttp://brickcityblog.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-2775429949231141032015-03-02T08:44:50.891-06:002015-03-02T08:44:50.891-06:00"Per your logic I sure shouldn't have tak..."Per your logic I sure shouldn't have taken on my current position at work... And based on your perspective, all people are averse to hard work and risk, even if rewards are offered.<br /><br />Where as I think the most hard working and brightest people strive to take on bigger challenges, especially if they are likely to be rewarded for succeeding."<br /><br />By your theory, then, tenured teachers should be flocking to the more challenging school environments. But we know this isn't what is actually happening.<br /><br />Is it merely because there isn't increased pay in those schools? That may be part of it, but I suspect it's not all of it. <br /><br />What's your theory?Seanhttp://brickcityblog.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-22494679045964453982015-03-01T19:15:38.916-06:002015-03-01T19:15:38.916-06:00"So far the improvement process is very slow ..."So far the improvement process is very slow moving and we have made no signifant changes or improvements."<br /><br />We could say that about MANY schools in the urban core, but for many of them it has been 20 years or more, not the first of three. And what it points out is that there MUST be new approaches to reach these kids "where they are" and move them to "where they need to be." It is said that insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. It's also the public schools.<br /><br />And those folks wanting less time spent on testing are simply trying to hide their failures. Besides, if the teachers "teach to the test," at least the kids would be learning SOMETHING.jerrye92002https://www.blogger.com/profile/01858692298982859775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-88885164800481733192015-03-01T17:31:49.124-06:002015-03-01T17:31:49.124-06:00I think some of Denise's comments make sense, ...I think some of Denise's comments make sense, however "providing more training" to Teachers in high risk schools seems kind of ironic coming from the group who let's their senior teachers avoid these schools.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14991027705809503541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-81245322072358826242015-03-01T16:46:33.848-06:002015-03-01T16:46:33.848-06:00You can always count on Ed MN for some interesting...You can always count on Ed MN for some interesting comment.<br /><br />Denise Specht, the head of the state's teachers union Education Minnesota, said the latest release of school rankings show troubling results for schools clustered in the state's high poverty areas.<br /> <br />"That tells me Minnesota must find better ways to meet the special needs of these students," Specht said. "Which could mean more training for the educators in the building, additional support staff like counselors and librarians, or even offering the broader range of mental and physical health care treatments found in full-service community schools."<br /> <br />Specht also cautioned parents from relying too much on the rankings to determine how well schools and teachers are doing.<br /> <br />Recently there's been growing worry among some teacher and parents that students spend too much classroom time preparing for, and taking, assessments tests.<br /> <br />Daniel Sellers, executive director of the education reform group MinnCan, said the results of the MMR rankings show just how important test scores like the Minnesota Comprehensive Assessments are.<br /> <br />"I worry that any attempts to get rid of standards-based assessments takes away an important piece of data that we have to determine whether or not we're on track for closing our achievement gaps," Seller said."Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14991027705809503541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-28812007624827634482015-03-01T11:37:24.716-06:002015-03-01T11:37:24.716-06:00We are in the first year of a three year improveme...We are in the first year of a three year improvement process. <br /><br /><a href="http://www.mprnews.org/story/2014/10/01/minnesota-school-rankings" rel="nofollow">State identifies 155 struggling schools, nearly half in the Twin Cities</a><br /><br /><a href="http://www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2014/02/26/22minnesota.h33.html" rel="nofollow">Minnesota Aims to Ratchet Down Achievement Gap</a><br /><br />The state has set an ambitious goal for us on our test scores and I expect we won't achieve it. I think shutting us down is only one option if we don't achieve it and there are other possibilites such as replacing staff. What happens if we don't make it is rarely talked about.<br /><br />So far the improvement process is very slow moving and we have made no signifant changes or improvements.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09905073449150541750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-69695093713693800942015-02-28T19:07:07.445-06:002015-02-28T19:07:07.445-06:00Laurie, I would really like to know more. You wil...Laurie, I would really like to know more. You will be shut down in 3 years (a total of 5?) if you don't "improve enough"? How is that measured? Why aren't other schools in the District shut down for failing just as badly with the same demographic? Do you think your school is doing as well as it could, or are you being less effective for lack of funding? What do other schools in your district get, by comparison, and would that "do it" for your school?jerrye92002https://www.blogger.com/profile/01858692298982859775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-23458707732868606372015-02-28T17:17:00.451-06:002015-02-28T17:17:00.451-06:00We are a charter school and $ comes from the state...We are a charter school and $ comes from the state, with some money from the federal government for title 1 and special education. If we haven't improved sufficiently in three years it will be the state which shuts us down.<br /><br />Our being shut down could be for the best for our students, except I think many of our families would enroll in another poorly performing charter, although some might choose schools that are having greater success. <br /><br />Then again, if measures other than MCA tests results are used to judge our results maybe we are not doing so badly.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09905073449150541750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-39558017547182596522015-02-28T16:26:28.698-06:002015-02-28T16:26:28.698-06:00Laurie, I think it's criminal that your school...Laurie, I think it's criminal that your school doesn't get at LEAST the same per-pupil funding as the other schools in your district. I strongly suspect it is because you are non-union and you (and your students) are being punished severely for that. I wish I had a solution other than equal vouchers for everybody, which is unlikely with the unions in charge. jerrye92002https://www.blogger.com/profile/01858692298982859775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-2841113365691101792015-02-28T11:56:09.950-06:002015-02-28T11:56:09.950-06:00I just skimmed over the first comment again and th...I just skimmed over the first comment again and thought about at my school we don't think about poverty at all. We are 96% low income and 94% English learner. Our focus is all about ELL, though I am sure poverty is impacting us a great deal as well. <br /><br />Many days I think they should give us more money, so we could offer summer school and extended day, or just shut us down.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09905073449150541750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-33596710181504433792015-02-28T08:54:54.856-06:002015-02-28T08:54:54.856-06:00And I LOVE those extra vacation days!And I LOVE those extra vacation days!jerrye92002https://www.blogger.com/profile/01858692298982859775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-75104931797229633902015-02-28T08:52:00.668-06:002015-02-28T08:52:00.668-06:00"Does your company have divisions/teams in wh..."Does your company have divisions/teams in which every employee fails in their job performance?" -- Laurie<br /><br />Not that I know of. What I would suggest to you is that the evaluation system which finds such is faulty. Now, it cannot be the same as the MBO (management by objectives) system that we use, where you and management mutually agree what you will tackle over the year (including when and "how much") and then you are rated on how well you did ALLOWING FOR things outside your control, or management's midstream change to the objectives. The goals AND the evaluation are based on what you should, with your seniority and "classification," be capable of. So, the salary review is largely objective, but there is the subjective component of what should be and what actually was possible for you. <br /><br />In the case of a teacher, the objective part is how much the average kid learned between day 1 and day 200. That should be compared with "1 year's learning" and not against some arbitrary standard for what X grade students should know. I think there should be some subjective factors in there, too, like how well the kids in your class have improved deportment (or not), plus any "special" things you might have done with them (field trip, whatever). For example, one class here looked after the fish tank. Then, after evaluation, only pay increases are determined, not dismissals. Repeated zero % raises are usually sufficient to convince "bad" employees to go where they are better "appreciated."jerrye92002https://www.blogger.com/profile/01858692298982859775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8193628934721963907.post-66099317483433244232015-02-28T07:39:45.859-06:002015-02-28T07:39:45.859-06:00Jerry,
Your comment reminds me of a discussion wit...Jerry,<br />Your comment reminds me of a discussion with a friend/co-worker. He was complaining about only getting a cost of living raise.<br /><br />Me being me, I asked him if he had learned any new skills or taken on any additional responsibility? He said "no". So I asked why he thought he deserved more than cost of living adjustment? He had no reason other he thought it sounded good.<br /><br />Senior employees typically get extra vacation to reward them for long service, I have never understood people who believe they should also get rewarded with significantly higher compensation when they are doing exactly the same job as a younger employee.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14991027705809503541noreply@blogger.com