"Better Opportunities for Children"Now my strange unacceptable comment went something like this...
In the same paragraph as you seem to be supporting better opportunities for children, you support abortion rights so as not to "obliterate the legal concept of privacy". Let's pause for a moment and consider those two ideas together. A moment wasn't long enough.
How about giving a child a chance to live, how is that for an opportunity?" Steve
"You consider Paul's comment inconsistent because you believe a fetus is the same thing as a child.
But for someone who does not believe a fetus is the same thing as a child, there is no inconsistency whatsoever.
It is unlikely that repeating this clarification will change your beliefs in any way, but it is still worth repeating it." Pat
"Pat, Roe v Wade acknowledges that a fetus is a person once viability is attained.
"The Court later rejected Roe's trimester framework, while affirming Roe's central holding that a person has a right to abortion until viability.[1] The Roe decision defined "viable" as being "potentially able to live outside the mother's womb, albeit with artificial aid", adding that viability "is usually placed at about seven months (28 weeks) but may occur earlier, even at 24 weeks."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roe_v._Wade
Now I know you pro-abortion folks like to say a fetus is not a "human", therefore lessening the tragedy of what is occurring... (ie dehumanize it) But here is something that should probably concern you. With improvements in medical technology, I am guessing the number of weeks to viability will continue to drop. That should make for some interesting court cases." G2A
"Being raised a farm boy, I am comfortable with hunting, killing and cutting up various animals. I am comfortable falling in a feed lot and cleaning up terrible messes. (ie sometimes it gets slippery) I am even ok with killing a sick family pet to put it out of its misery. However, I simply could not with my own hands discontinue the life of a 12+ week or older fetus.So what do you think, do these folks truly see the 12+ week old fetus as similar to a tumor? Or is their dehumanizing it actually their way to protect themselves from the consequences of the action that is occurring? And the freedoms they are defending?"
Pat's comment made me wonder. Would folks who consider a 12+ week old fetus "inhuman" be willing to personally squeeze that little body until it's heart stopped beating? I mean if it is truly no different than some cancer cells or a mole, then it shouldn't be a problem. If they did personally stop that heart, would their conscience plague them?" G2A
Thoughts?
"Now I know you pro-abortion folks like to say a fetus is not a "human"..."
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure that's accurate. It's more accurate to say that many pro-CHOICE folks think there's a difference between a fetus and a person.
There is a lot of coded language thrown about in this debate:
Pro-choice =/= Pro-abortion, but very few on the other side of the issue will ever try to understand the distinction.
All I want from pro-life folks is absolute consistency. i.e. as much advocacy and support for living persons as for potential persons.
It's hard for me to have this discussion, because I hate the labels. They're too imprecise.
I consider myself to be in favor of the living. Does that make me pro-life?
If I believe that all potential persons should be born, despite the wishes of the already living person, the mother, am I pro-life? Doesn't seem accurate to me, because I've just set aside the rights and beliefs of a living person in favor of a potential person. It would seem a more accurate term would be 'pro-birth'.
I know that for a good number of people, this is not a difficult issue. It's black & white, good & evil, right & wrong. I see too many shades of gray to ever have confidence that my belief is absolutely correct.
Joel
Some background, I agree with most of what you said.
ReplyDeleteI have labelled myself anti-abortion pro-choice, at least until the fetus is 12 weeks old. After that I think there had better be some really compelling reason for stopping that little heart.
I just find it interesting that the strong pro-abortion folks choose to de-humanize the fetus, instead of just saying they are killing an unwanted undeveloped human for practical reasons.
about "personally squeezing that little body until it's heart stopped beating? I think of abortion differently. One third of abortion occur at or before six weeks. At that time the embryo is 1/4 inch long. Women take a medication women which causes the lining of the uterus breaks down and ends the pregnancy.
ReplyDeleteI don't think of abortion as a small or happy choice, but lets not imagine killing a fully developed baby.
That's why I picked 12 weeks or older.
ReplyDeleteThe link I provided is apparently a photo of a 12 week old miscarried fetus. Definitely not a bouncing baby boy... Yet...
I was thinking of when we would find nests of baby mice in the barns. Hairless little bodies, eye closed, huddled for warmth, etc. And we would crush them with our boot.
ReplyDeleteMany readers will likely find that terrible, yet they are fine with abortion. That is what I find fascinating.