This is an interesting opinion piece.
CNN America is in Need of Leaders
Now I personally have a lot of cynicism and dislike for most Upper Level Managers, CEOs and Politicians. That is because I am hard wired to be a Servant Leader, whereas most of the Upper Level Managers, CEOs and Politicians I have worked with and heard speak seem to be Traditional Top Down Leaders who see themselves as the focal point.
This is part of why I was laid off from my previous employer almost 5 years ago now, and why I am much more comfortable working as a Project Manager. I am happy to work hard with my team and to mentor / support those who have less knowledge and experience. However when it comes to doing as told by upper managers when it seems illogical or against the company's principles, I tend to speak up and try to change things. Unfortunately self focused Traditional Top Down Managers tend to shoot the messenger... I would be a terrible military soldier...
The challenge of course is that self focused Traditional Top Down Managers tend to be the people who are willing to drag their family around the country and world to climb the ladder, get more power and larger compensation. I have to assume we have the same challenge when it comes to politicians, that is why there are so many narcissists in office.
Often the best leaders and politicians are those who were reluctantly promoted or voted into that position. By the way, I am also a big fan of Deming's work.
CNN America is in Need of Leaders
Now I personally have a lot of cynicism and dislike for most Upper Level Managers, CEOs and Politicians. That is because I am hard wired to be a Servant Leader, whereas most of the Upper Level Managers, CEOs and Politicians I have worked with and heard speak seem to be Traditional Top Down Leaders who see themselves as the focal point.
This is part of why I was laid off from my previous employer almost 5 years ago now, and why I am much more comfortable working as a Project Manager. I am happy to work hard with my team and to mentor / support those who have less knowledge and experience. However when it comes to doing as told by upper managers when it seems illogical or against the company's principles, I tend to speak up and try to change things. Unfortunately self focused Traditional Top Down Managers tend to shoot the messenger... I would be a terrible military soldier...
The challenge of course is that self focused Traditional Top Down Managers tend to be the people who are willing to drag their family around the country and world to climb the ladder, get more power and larger compensation. I have to assume we have the same challenge when it comes to politicians, that is why there are so many narcissists in office.
Often the best leaders and politicians are those who were reluctantly promoted or voted into that position. By the way, I am also a big fan of Deming's work.
Poor leaders are really a consequence of the decline of our country, not really a cause.
ReplyDelete--Hiram
Personally I think it is a bit of a "chicken or egg problem".
ReplyDeletePlease elaborate on "decline of our country"?
I think many Americans would define it very differently, even while agreeing with your sentiment.
I feel like from the GOP we get widespread bad leadership and from the dems we suffer from a lack of leadership. I think the GOP is at much greater fault for the decline or death of our country. (voters too, for putting these guys in power) (media too, for misinforming the voters)
ReplyDeleteI watch and read a fair amt of news and don't see anyone who stands out and excites me as a strong leader in the dem party. The 2020 election worries me a bit as the country needs a major course correction.
Democrats aren't led well. We are an undisciplined, unruly group by nature. We aren't much impressed by arguments from authority. Elsewhere, I am talking quite openly about whether Franken should resign, where Alabama Republican line up totally and unquestioningly behind Roy Moore, or Donald Trump. This questioning attitude isn't something I would give up, I think it's an asset, but it's not without it's downside. Among other things, it makes us vulnerable to the constant charges of hypocrisy and double standards as we try to come to grips with a complex world without the solace of Republican absolutism.
ReplyDeleteOh well.
--Hiram
The challenge is that "quality of leadership" is not based on whether you agree with them or not. If that were the case I may have found Obama to be a terrible leader.
ReplyDeleteQuality of leadership to me is if they have a vision that makes some sense, they can describe it in a manner that people can understand and they can convince the majority to be excited about it.
Now this is very difficult in an organization as large, diverse and spread out as the USA.
Now Obama accomplished some of the above, whereas Trump is failing terribly.
ReplyDeleteNow back to "decline of our country".
ReplyDeleteIt seems that both of you think something is wrong.
Please describe it.
ReplyDeleteWill Donald Trump Destroy the Presidency?
there is something wrong when a large number of citizens will vote for and continue to support a man like Trump. And it is not only Trump who is the problem. the GOP congress no longer follows norms of governing either
Forget alternative facts. We’re now in an alternate reality.
I think our level of polarization is another indicator of failure in leadership, though that one is tricky, as Obama was an outstanding leader in terms of oratory skills and the polarization increased tremendously while he was president. I'll blame the GOP again whose primary objective was that Obama fail as president.
oops. here is that second link again:
ReplyDeleteForget alternative facts. We’re now in an alternate reality.
The challenge is that "quality of leadership" is not based on whether you agree with them or not. If that were the case I may have found Obama to be a terrible leader.
ReplyDeleteLet's not forget that leadership is a morally neutral quality. Bad people can be good leaders.
Now, of course, we have a president now who is neither good nor an effective leader, just a small time operator terrified the cops are about to knock on his door. George Bush, for example, was a remarkable and far more effective leadership. Since Republicans believe in a leadership model, it's perhaps not surprising that they can be pretty good at it. The problem with Bush wasn't his leadership, it's with where he led us.
The greatest political leader of the 20th century was perhaps Winston Churchill. I often look at his speeches just for the thrill of it. They are models of a certain kind of political prose. Yet is it any surprise that as admired he was by the British people, they threw him out of office the first time they got the chance? For the uncharismatic Atlee? Leadership is ok in certain cases, but it isn't without it's severe limits. For the most part, I am comfortable leaving the reverance for it to the Republicans.
--
Laurie,
ReplyDeleteHere is my favorite part of the long somewhat boring Atlantic piece...
"Citizens’ trust in American institutions has been in decline for a while. That’s one reason Donald Trump was elected. His assault on those institutions, and the defiant reactions to his assault, will further diminish that trust and make it yet harder to resolve social and political disputes.
The breakdown in institutions mirrors the breakdown in social cohesion among citizens that was also a major cause of Trumpism, and that Trumpism has churned further. This is perhaps the worst news of all for our democracy. As Cass Sunstein lamented in his book #Republic, “Members of a democratic public will not do well if they are unable to appreciate the views of their fellow citizens, if they believe ‘fake news,’ or if they see one another as enemies or adversaries in some kind of war.
And yet folks on both sides continue to do just that.
maybe Trump will be so bad he will somewhat unite the country in opposition to him, though the division with his base / core supporters will grow more intense
ReplyDeleteThe WAPO piece was just silly... I guess I don't see political maneuverings as proof of the
ReplyDelete"decline of our country".
What concerns me is:
- the increase of single parent families
- the continued failure of many children to be academically / socially capable at age 18
- the increasing amount of government handouts with no performance requirements
- American consumers ever growing passion for cheap / good products and services with no regard to how it impacts the US economy and their fellow citizens
Please remember that politicians have been fighting since before our country was formed. It is what us citizens do that matters most.
the title of your post is America needs better leaders, yet you don't seem to care at all what kind of leaders we have. Makes no sense.
ReplyDeleteI think it matters a great deal who are leaders are and voting is one of the most important things citizens do. When we elected Obama and the dems back in 2008 it decreased the number of uninsured by 20 million. Seems to me my vote had much more impact than my donating $20 to some fundraiser to for someone looking for help to pay their medical bills.
Laurie,
ReplyDeleteYes your preferred leader did accomplish "increasing amount of government handouts with no performance requirements" to a level we had not seen before in the USA. Which of course from my perspective furthered the decline of America...
My perspective being... "Don't worry about learning, staying married, working hard, making good choices, having only children you can afford, etc. We will take from people who do and give to you..."
Now I know that the topic is Leaders, however the specific question was about Hiram's "decline of America".
The biggest problem with Trump is that he is a terrible leader, maybe Pence could get more done to reverse the "decline of America".
ReplyDeleteI guess I don't see political maneuverings as proof of the
ReplyDelete"decline of our country".
Clearly, the election of someone unfit to be president is clear and very convincing evidence of the decline of our country. Healthy nations don't elect Donald Trumps.
I do think the kind of political maneuverings we see are further decline of our nation. In 2016, the senate was simply unable to take up the Supreme Court nomination of Merrick Garland. It's easy to blame Republicans for that, but I think the problem was deeper than that, a failure of both parties to adhere to the norms of democracy, for which democrats like me share at least a portion of the responsibility.
--Hiram
The biggest problem with Trump is that he is a terrible leader,
ReplyDeleteIn terms of problems Trump has, there is a lot to choose from. As a Democrat of course, leadership isn't something I value a lot. That's more a Republican thing. Obama as a leader had his ups and down, but he was a vastly better president than George Bush who was as effective a political leader I have seen since perhaps Richard Nixon.
--Hiram
I think that is one of the reasons Liberals should be over joyed with keeping Trump in place as President. I think Pence would be more effective at getting the GOP agenda passed. (ie George Bush)
ReplyDeleteNow as for "Healthy nations don't elect Trump". I can agree with that Trump being elected is a symptom of an illness. Just as if Bernie Sanders had been elected.
The challenge is that treating symptoms is not a very efficient method of solving the problem.
For ref G2A Nolan
ReplyDeleteWith a significant portion of our citizens seeing growing government control even more and turning us into a near "Democratic Socialist" country as success / "not declining".
And a significant percent seeing the above as causing the decline.. And fighting it tooth and nail.
There is no wonder our politician choices seem strange.
Liberals should be over joyed with keeping Trump in place as President
ReplyDeleteIt's like Fox News which always seems to be worried about what's good for liberals. I don't know how many commentators on their shows arguing that we need to do this or that or we will be toasted politically. I don't really care about being toasted politically. For better or worse, I am involved in politics because I care about issues. I assume the other side feels the same way. If positions I take cost me elections, will that's unfortunate and bitter tears will be shed, but in the final analysis I am ok with that.
If Trump is bad for the country, as without he is, it's little or no consolation that he might be good for the Democratic Party. All of us will suffer.
--Hiram
ReplyDeleteThe challenge is that treating symptoms is not a very efficient method of solving the problem.
Some problems are insoluble, all you can do is respond to the symptoms. We have elected an unfit president. There is nothing we can do about that. But we can act to make sure he does as little damage as possible. Let's not forget that as bad as Donald is, the American people voted for the other guy, and that in itself, is cause for hope.
--Hiram
an analogy that says both Pence and Sanders are symptoms of what is wrong with country - our polarized, extremist views - would be a better comparison.
ReplyDeleteyou keep overlooking how Trump is uniquely unfit to be president in an unprecedented way. Sanders is a normal candidate with far left political views. People did not write articles about his mental illnesses. Sander is not a sexual predator.
One problem with Pence is that anyone who accepts office from Trump is politically soiled. It's one reason why I find it so easy, compelling even, to oppose Trump's junicial nominations.
ReplyDelete--Hiram
Laurie,
ReplyDeleteI have always agreed that Trump is a lying narcissist of major proportions who really likes beautiful women, money and the spot light... And he seems to have a real hard time with thinking before speaking.
Beyond that... What has done in office so far to prove himself "unfit"?
I agree that he is definitely different from those life long bureaucrats / politicians... However I am not sure that is a bad thing. Please remember that those supposedly "fit politicians" have brought us to where we are today.
That "American Decline" we were discussing. And Bernie would only double down on the far Left policies that have contributed to it. (ie hand outs without strings, strong public employee unions, government bureaucracy, many regulatory hurdles, etc)
Hiram,
ReplyDeleteThe challenges that the US faces can be solved. We just need to have the determination to promote / mandate personal responsibility, and willingness to support people as they struggle to improve their lives and those of their children.
Trump has told thousands of lies and has shown zero interest in being truthful, he has many conflicts of interest and has used the presidency to enrich himself, he colluded with Russia to help get elected, he is very erratic and dangerous in his foreign policy and interactions with world leaders (puts us at higher risk for war.) He has filled agencies with unqualified people or left positions unfilled. Sean or Hiram could give you a better list than these quick points off the top of my head.
ReplyDeleteRight now I am going into work so I will not take time to find more evidence of how he is unfit. My recent link from the Atlantic had lots of examples of how he is destroying the presidency.
The challenges that the US faces can be solved
ReplyDeleteThere is nothing inherently insoluble about many of them. The problem is that America has lots it's ability to solve problems. It's our dysfunction that's the issue.
--Hiram
Laurie,
ReplyDeleteI guess I am saying that after all the Liberal panic and hand wringing that has taken place since Trump was elected, I think it has been pretty tame.
The courts still work and Trump has not ignored them...
Congress is still the sticking point in getting things done...
No atomic bombs have been dropped on anyone...
The news media is functioning the same as before Trump came to office...
The military keeps fighting terrorism...
Where is the end of our Democracy that you and your cohorts predicted?
Trump has been president for less than a year. Give him time. I hope I am wrong, but I still expect disaster. I have been surprised at how incompetent the GOP has been in passing their agenda.
ReplyDeleteTrump as president has not has as bad a record as Bush. But his presidency is young.
ReplyDeleteRepublicans have a big advantage always, in the leadership game. Republicans want to nothing, and nothing is almost always easier to do than something. Therefore, Republicans find it easier to be successful than Democrats. Unfortunately, when Republicans who are so committed to the idea of government as incompetent, when they do try to do something when they are in power, they do it incompetently out of an instinctive understanding that if they do things well, they will undermine their rationale for being.
--Hiram
Laurie,
ReplyDeleteKeep up that positive attitude... :-) I am personally going to keep hoping that he is learning, albeit very slowly.
Hiram,
Please remember that the GOP folk believe that 100 years of ever increasing government control and arbitrary wealth transfer is the root cause of our country's supposed decline.
So actually they have a LOT of things they want to do, and it is a bit likely fighting the tide as citizens keep getting more dependent on the government for checks and services instead of being self reliant and personally responsible.
By the way, having the government provide services and money to tax payers is not a problem as long as they are truly disabled, it is short term or they are doing something to earn it. (ie work, self improvement to become independent, etc) The problem is that the government needs to take all that money from other citizens and we have few expectations of the recipients.
ReplyDeletePlease remember that the GOP folk believe that 100 years of ever increasing government control and arbitrary wealth transfer is the root cause of our country's supposed decline.
ReplyDeleteFor many of those decades we did pretty well in ways that amaze even me. The country took off after WW II despite punitive levels of taxation, something even I wouldn't have predicted. I think the decline started in the Reagan years, something that continued during the Clinton administration who in many ways, was Reagan lite, and whose indiscipline set up the disastrous second Bush administration.
--Hiram
Yes. That is about when many American Consumers gave up on supporting American workers for the good of their own pocket book.
ReplyDeleteHere is an interesting discussion AT Do trade deficits matter?
Other factors:
ReplyDelete- Foreign countries were recovering from WWII and ready to compete
- Japan had listened to Deming, where as American companies thought they knew better
- China started to open themselves up to the world
- Cost of ocean transport kept falling
- US Mgmt and Unions were proud and wasteful (ie at consumers expense)