Now I know that my yearly raise did not impress me, and it seems I am not alone... Maybe that is why I am blogging right now instead of working. Some kind of passive aggressive rebellion. 😁
To me it seems we are a very confused and conflicted society... Here is why:
Liberals swear that:
And of course automation is only going to make this worse... We will need fewer low skill low knowledge employees, and more high skill high paid workers... Thoughts?
CNN Show Me the Money
CNN Wisconsin Foxconn: Wage Increase Concerns
CNN California Sanctuary State
CNN California Homelessness
To me it seems we are a very confused and conflicted society... Here is why:
Liberals swear that:
- They want Americans to be paid more, but they want to allow more low skill low academic workers to immigrate or stay here which increases the worker supply a lot, and the worker demand a little which makes it harder for our low skill low academic workers to find good paying jobs.
- Then they make this worse by being frustrated when companies get "low tax" incentives to make huge investments in a community.
- Then they seem to believe that "workers" should not have to move physically or adjust to get these better jobs. They comment that it is a terrible burden for these folks. The irony being of course that tens of millions of legal and illegal have sacrificed much more to get those same jobs.
- Finally they often really like VWs, Subarus and Other Low Domestic Content vehicles.
- Conservatives say they want to bring jobs back to America so wages will increase and yet many complain when they have a hard time finding help.
- They seem to want growth while keeping wages constrained, so that the Investors get more profit.
- Finally they complain about the skill / knowledge level of the labor pool while fighting against making training programs low cost to the trainee.
CNN Show Me the Money
CNN Wisconsin Foxconn: Wage Increase Concerns
CNN California Sanctuary State
CNN California Homelessness
25 comments:
Politically, immigration cuts several ways. Democrats are into the human aspect, we are concerned with the health and well being of people who are here. We are also aware that a lot of people are dependent on immigrants. They have family who are American citizens who are part of what we are see as our natural constituency. And in political terms, as immigrants become citizens and a political force, we want them to be on our side.
Republicans like immigrants because they represewnt a cheap and flexible labor source.They want to be able to manage immigration in ways they see as more efficient and effective. We tend to think that doesn't work, but Republicans are far more confident in their capabilities than they are capable.
--Hiram
I don't think conservatives want to bring manufacturing jobs back to America. They represent a constituency that wants to make money. Now Trump did campaign on that sort of thing but he shows no interest in governing that way. Protectionism is far more popular with Democrats than Republicans, but we are less willing to demagogue the issue.
--Hiram
Finally they often really like VWs, Subarus and Other Low Domestic Content vehicles.
I have actually talked to labor types, and what I have told them is that they can't and maybe shouldn't expect preferences because they are domestic. The product must be competitive. But I am not a fan of unlevel playing fields either.
The irony here is that Trump ate our lunch on this issue during the campaign. He argued for protectionism, a generally discredited economic idea. Protectionism is an argument we as Democrats, lost.
--Hiram
Hiram,
As for Liberals and immigration. I asked my FB friend the following and got no real answer.
"Based on my travels, there are maybe 3 BILLION people in the world who would love to move to the USA. I am curious what criteria you think we should use in deciding who we should let join our big dysfunctional family?"
From my perspective, it seems the Liberal immigration goal is to help everyone... And send the bill to "America's Businesses and Wealthy"... And when their costs increase, it get less attractive to run parts of their businesses in the USA.
I mean if one really wants to help America's low academic and low skill workers... We should only be immigrating Doctors, Dentists, Nurses, Engineers, Lawyers, etc and other similar positions so that some of our costs would fall. And companies would need to pay more for low level positions.
Where as most Liberals of I have heard from are all about letting more low academic low skill refugees come here.
Hiram,
The GOP represents small government capitalists of all income levels. I am not sure how DEMs think the GOP would keep winning if only the top .1% were voting for them?
As you know, I am totally against protectionism...
I am for people who strongly advocate for "American Workers / Unions" and higher American Taxes
while bashing American Companies for moving elsewhere to save money, improve quality, etc
spending their money on "American Workers", not sending their money overseas to "foreign workers" and foreign governments.
We should let more people come to the country, period. I agree with Trump that we should absolutely try to increase our high-skilled immigration (and work to make our licensing easier to facilitate this). We also should not shy away from allowing refugees to come to our country, which is in standing with our great American traditions.
"our great American traditions"...
Now you do remember why we had such an "open door" policy don't you?
We had a huge amount of land, jobs and not nearly enough people...
Or do think it was out of the goodness of our heart?
Now our land is all owned by someone...
Most people do not want to live "out on the land" anyway. (ie rural / hard work)
And since say wages are too low, we must have too many low skill / low academic workers in the country.
And you think the way to help all those people is to "let more people come to the country, period".
And you want to do this as automation is going to keep reducing the number of workers who are needed in these sectors.
And the Liberal answer to "too many workers driving down wages"... Is to mandate higher than needed wages and to jack up taxes on the wealthy regularly so we can give more services and money to the extra unqualified workers you invited in.
How do you see this ending well?
I'm not suggesting that we throw the doors open to everyone, as I have repeatedly made clear in the past. There's no reason to reduce the number of legal immigrants coming in, though. We currently face worker shortages in some areas, and will face shortages as the Baby Boomers retire (notably in education and health care). Having a properly structured (and more robust than today) flow of legal immigrants is also a way to help stem the demographic tide that threatens the prosperity of future generations.
If you want to talk about ways to do such a thing, I'm open to doing so. If you're going to continue to persist that I favor some sort of open borders policy, count me out of this conversation.
From past exchanges I think we are not so far apart.
So what do you think of the Trump Immigration Proposal?
Personally I think it is on the right track except that the number of legal immigrants should be increased. Not decreased...
I especially like the points idea
And the Liberal answer to "too many workers driving down wages"..
I think what liberals say is that business brings in workers to drive wages down. Are we wrong?
--Hiram
I am sure there are cases where that is correct. I think I covered that in the post:
"They seem to want growth while keeping wages constrained, so that the Investors get more profit."
I was thinking of Grand Marais this morning... The businesses there usually staff up with dozens of young people from all over the world for the Summer season... How high would they need to raise wages to get young Americans to do those jobs for 3 or 4 months?
Along a similar vein is all of the agricultural labor that we need?
Would that be good or bad for our society?
I find it interesting that many DEMs seem to think they are going to get something they really want without giving Trump what he really wants...
MSN Warren on DACA Negotiations
Politico DACA Negotiations
I find it interesting that many DEMs seem to think they are going to get something they really want without giving
We don't feel under much pressure to negotiate for stuff that should be done as a matter of good policy anyway. Trump has Cleavon Little tendencies as a negotiator; he sees holding himself hostage as an effective strategy. Trump is a difficult negotiator, but that doesn't necessarily make him a good or effective negotiator.
--Hiram
Extension of DACA rights, in our view, is good policy. But it isn't necessarily a popular strategy or one that advances our electoral prospects. And as the minority party, we don't bear the responsibility if it fails. The upshot of all of this is that we aren't under very much pressure to negotiate the issue. It would be different if we were in power. Being in power means you have to take responsibility for tough decisions. But we are, so we don't have to.
--Hiram
In a way I see it...
I mean the DEMs can argue in the Fall that they were totally powerless to protect the DACA recipients because of the BIG BAD GOP...
I am not sure if that will get their voters out or if many will just shake their heads in apathetic disbelief...
As I wrote to Liberal friend on FB.
"A continuous theme running through my head is that Trump and the GOP have given the DEMs a great opportunity in 2018. The challenge though is that the DEMs need to offer more than just criticism. They need to offer a path to more better jobs for low academic low skill Americans, and part of that is to limit the influx of more low academic low skill immigrants with whom they have to compete. It will be interesting to see the DEMs plan... Or if they are going to continue to artificially drive up wages through government laws while flooding the market with more low end labor... "
I mean the DEMs can argue in the Fall that they were totally powerless to protect the DACA recipients because of the BIG BAD GOP...
To the extent we talk about it, we will talk about Trump taking away DACA protections. Would that be wrong? Does their decisions to take away DACA provisions make the GOP bad? That's for voters to decide.
It's conventional wisdom among Democrats that Republicans will not beat themselves, that we need a positive agenda. But that is more a technical, inside baseball, matter. There is certainly a lot of stuff we are for. When we were in power, Republicans never for a moment complained about a lack of a record for them to attack.
--Hiram
I for one am anxious to see it...
Hopefully they move more towards the center and what is practical for America's normal working class citizens.
And stop obsessing about illegal workers, LGBT folks and welfare recipients, public employee unions, saving every critter, punishing American employers, etc... Maybe then even I would vote for them ... :-)
"So what do you think of the Trump Immigration Proposal?"
Pieces of it are OK. As I've said, I favor increasing skilled immigration. Adding additional capacity in our immigration courts are good, and I'm fine with making it easier to send back those caught at border crossings.
I think other pieces of his policy, such as the Muslim ban, the wall, prohibitions on sanctuary cities, are not helpful.
And has no one told him that if the ban on chain migration had been in place when his family came over, he wouldn't be here right now?
Now I did a word search and did not find the word Muslim in there once...
And we are covering sanctuary cities else where...
As for "the wall", I really don't see a downside, to me it is just a HUGE JOBs program with some practical benefits.. :-)
No, the Muslim ban isn't in there, but it's part of his policy.
If we're going to dump money into a jobs program, we could do a lot better than building a wall in the desert.
How can it "be part of his policy" and "not be in his policy document"?
Even if the wall were to only reduce illegal immigration and smuggling by 50%, I think it would pay for itself in lives saved and low skill employee gains very quickly.
I wonder how many people die each year as they try to travel from Central America and other countries because of our weak Southern Border and the Hope it gives them... My guess is the answer is in the tens of thousands.
"How can it "be part of his policy" and "not be in his policy document"?"
He's issued two executive orders on the subject.
"Even if the wall were to only reduce illegal immigration and smuggling by 50%"
What makes you think it will even be that effective? Most drugs don't come across the unwalled border, they come in via the ports of entry.
Post a Comment