You know how I like to keep our posts and comments somewhat aligned. :-)
And Molly, you have some reading to do to catch up with our 10+ years of arguing this...
See the links below...
G2A Health Search
G2A Healthcare Cost Control
G2A Sean Healthcare Improvement Plan
And Molly, you have some reading to do to catch up with our 10+ years of arguing this...
See the links below...
Sean, My guess is that she thinks the "activist judges" should have ruled against it... SCOTUS now rules against ACA, Not supported it. G2A
Molly, Now I need to find a reason to post about ACA to see what you disliked about it and if you have a better solution. :-) G2A
All, It was a very complicated ruling. In the end the court claimed that forcing people to buy something was a tax and Obama had told the public that is was not a tax. He told the public if you like your doctor you can keep your doctor and said that it would save people money all untrue.Molly
Molly, I lost my highly desirable plan also. No love here for the Unaffordable Care Act. Jerry
John, I thought the original point of the ACA was to to get insurance for the uninsured. I would have rather had a tax to all to pay for those folks to have insurance rather than completely change our healthcare system. Molly
All, The real problem with the ACA is that it didn't change our healthcare system enough. Sean
Sean, Nonsense. The ACA was supposed to solve all health care problems, for everybody, for all time. Maybe the actual legislation did not match the promises made for it? Jerry
Sean, what did you want the ACA to do that it didn’t? Molly
All, "X was supposed to solve all problems" is a classic straw man argument. There is no health care policy that will solve all problems. Making that the goal of policy is a de facto decision to have no health care policy at all. ==Hiram
All, I did not suggest that the ACA /could/ solve all problems. I merely suggest that is what was promised and not delivered. And how did we get off on this old topic? JerryG2A ACA Search
G2A Health Search
G2A Healthcare Cost Control
G2A Sean Healthcare Improvement Plan
15 comments:
Molly,
I think so far you have avoided answering both my questions.
1. What was specifically wrong with ACA?
2. What better option do you prefer?
From my viewpoint it had it's good and bad aspects. And part of the reason it did not become even better was because the GOP keeps trying to kill it rather than improve it.
At it's most basic it did these good things:
1. It punished people with fines if they chose to not carry health insurance. These fines should have been much larger, because tax payers end up paying the bills for many irresponsible uninsured patients. Either through bankruptcies, higher fees, ER service funding, etc.
We make driver's carry liability insurance so others do not have to pay their expenses, this no different.
2. It pressured people to have full service policies so that their potential illness would be covered. Skimpy policies with skimpy coverage run out of coverage quick. Ask the bankrupt folks out there.
3. It did raise taxes, it did expand medicaid and it did help the poor pay their health insurance premiums.
4. It mandated that people with pre-existing conditions could get coverage at a reasonable price.
5. It allowed young adults to stay on their parent's insurance until they are 26.
6. It mandated that older citizens pay no more than 3 times what younger citizens pay for the same coverage.
As for the downsides... It raised taxes on rich people and medical devices...
The Balance Pros / Cons
HM Pro / Con
Vitanna Pros / Cons
PG Premiums without ACA
BI ACA Premiums
Now just think how much better ACA would be now if the GOP was not trying to sabotage it every chance they get. :-)
And of course now that more people approve than disapprove... Their efforts are kind of foolish.
John,
I will take a look at the info on ACA.
Molly
That is one of my favorite things about this hobby.
It gives me a reason to learn about many things. :-)
"I merely suggest that is what was promised and not delivered. "
Are you in favor of delivering what was promised?
--Hiram
John,
I’ll look at the debates you folks have been having over the past 10 years. I am interested on how you all have evolved. I don’t think I can answer your specific questions at this time.
When the ACA passed, I started noticing some negative consequences right away. I have a child with special needs and clinics started having long wait times with doctors leaving etc. Employers were up in arms about the impact on their businesses. The ACA added more regulations and forced small insurers out.
I know a lot has changed since then. I realize your group has rehashed this stuff so no need to go on with it.
I have seen Twila Brase give presentations on the subject a few times over the years and I like the research she has done. Her point of view makes a lot of sense to me.
I think the only reason I brought up the ACA in the first place was someone asked about reasons people vote a certain way.
Molly
While learning is one of the best parts of my hobby...
Our inability to evolve is one of the most frustrating things...
Everyone is about where they were 10 years ago when ACA passed. :-)
The upside about this group is that we are tenacious... We will have no problem discussing ACA again. :-)
It seems like Twila and her CCHF are pretty one sided in their assessment.
It looks like she is a Libertarian who fears Big Brother.
I am curious what solutions she supports to ensure everyone can afford to get healthcare?
Jerry is going to like her though...
"The only “fix” is full repeal and returning health care to the states, which is required under the 10th Amendment."
I assume that means no more Medicare, no more Medicaid, no more Health Insurance subsidies, etc?
I often wonder if the "we need to go back to the 1950 folks", really want that...
A time before really cool and expensive devices and medications.
PBS Health Timeline
Kaiser Health Timeline
US Mortality History
This is an interesting conclusion from my last link...
The dramatic decline in mortality over the last century is one of the most striking features of recent U.S. (and world) history. Knowledge, science, and technology have propelled a steady extension of Americans' lifespans and improvements in the quality of their lives even at older ages. Advances in the understanding of infectious diseases and investments in sanitation, water purification, and other public health improvements eliminated infectious disease as a major cause of death. Scientific innovations of new drugs, treatments, and medical devices together with improved health behaviors related to smoking, nutrition, and obesity further reduced mortality from cancer and cardiac diseases.
Nevertheless, not all Americans have shared equally in the benefits of health-enhancing knowledge and innovation. While differences in life expectancy by gender and race are narrowing, those with less education have fallen further behind. Differences in income and corresponding inequalities in access to health care may play some role in this divergence, but the evidence suggests that other factors are also important. Education exerts a direct effect on reducing mortality and morbidity through the adoption of healthier lifestyles, more effective management of chronic diseases, and more frequent and appropriate use of advanced treatment opportunities.
Looking forward, there is little reason to expect the development of life saving ideas and technologies to slow. While this is welcoming news for humanity, it also means higher costs for the federal government from two sources. Seniors will receive more expensive health care benefits and they will collect all federal retiree benefits for longer periods. This uncertainty implies greater risk of substantial increases in federal elder-support expenditures and budget deficits.
As Republicans like to point out, health insurance isn't about health care, it's about paying for health care. One way or another health care will be paid for. It's a question of how it can be done efficiently with the least negative impact on the economy.
--Hiram
Hiram,
This seems like a pretty big assumption...
"One way or another health care will be paid for."
I mean "healthcare " can be giving someone Tylenol
to
providing them with major surgery, expensive
medications and/or replacement parts...
Remember my story about how Italy controlled end of life care costs for a woman with stage 4 cancer... They gave her a check for $50,000 and told her to enjoy the end of her life. :-)
Here is an interesting piece
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