John Pavlovitz The Cult of Trump
This is a very thought provoking piece posted by a liberal FB friend... Here were our comments:
So I just love them the way they are and hope that someday they will come back to their senses... :-)
This is a very thought provoking piece posted by a liberal FB friend... Here were our comments:
We’ve all lost someone to this cult. FB Friend
Very interesting piece. I think Rush Limbaugh and similar started the programming long before Trump. But of course I think folks on the far left suffer from a similar but different cult. It is strange having parents in one and kids in the other. G2A
I think there is a lot more distance between the “mainstream left” and the “far left” than there is between the “mainstream right” and the “far right.” FB Friend
Maybe... Not too sure though... Warren and Sanders seem pretty popular. G2AAnd I was being honest about having loved ones in each cult. Just asking questions or showing facts / data in their ways of thinking triggers them to either clam up, call me names or walk away.
So I just love them the way they are and hope that someday they will come back to their senses... :-)
20 comments:
The real enemy today is tribalism, and the more you label people the more tribalism you get. Sit down with an individual, ask what motivates them to believe the way they do (on an issue), and once you get past the labels and the talking points, you will find we're pretty much all the same.
The real enemy today is tribalism.
I don't like to speak in terms of enemies. Lots of great people are tribalists, and lots of people who aren't because they are uninformed and/or indecisive. Tribalism is often a pejorative term for people who work together for a common set of goals.
The fact is, our country has been deteriorating for a good long while. Trump is a symptom of our national decline, not the start of it. One of our two major parties, the one which long ago nominated Abraham Lincoln for president, chose as it's candidate a man who was manifestly unfit for office, someone who is at least a borderline psychopath and criminal. Tribalism is not at fault for that.
--Hiram
Hiram, you have it wrong. Tribalism is the only reason people hate Trump. It isn't anything he has done, except that he is unwilling to be harassed and harangued for simply belonging to "the other tribe." The tribe that ran the KKK doesn't like being challenged.
Tribalism is the only reason people hate Trump.
I think the reason Trump is disliked is because he isn't a likable person. And that's kind of sad really, and in a different context would elicit pity. Trump is someone who has been laughed at all his life. As is typical with bullies, he himself has been bullied. His personal history is one of craving respect he has never received. I know I find it difficult to hate such a damaged soul. The fact is, I have been somewhat harsher in my personal judgments of George Bush because he is someone who knows better. But none of those factors are reasons to elect someone president.
Although some affect to dispute it, I don't think it's reasonably disputable that Trump lacks the moral character to be president. I think everyone knows that, but they were willing to overlook it because he was able to deliver the Supreme Court to the Republican Party for generations to come, a legacy that will far outlast Trump's presidency. In addition, he delivered the tax cuts the wealthy crave so much. But we have to ask ourselves, was it worth it? Republican control of the Supreme Court may well prove to be hollow victory when quite possibly the next president and Congress will terminate the court's power of judicial review. The tax cuts are spent, and will vanish with the next recession. How will Republicans justify the selling of their souls when as it turns out, they didn't even get a mess of pottage for them?
--Hiram
"Tribalism is the only reason people hate Trump. It isn't anything he has done, except that he is unwilling to be harassed and harangued for simply belonging to "the other tribe."
Jerry,
Do you truly believe this?
Let's name a few actions / words from Trump that have made people disrespect and dislike him:
- 3 wives
- countless mistresses
- sexual assaults
- bankruptcies
- fraudulent business operation
- Increasing the National Debt by $8+ trillion in a boom cycle
- separated children from parents
- pointless name calling and pointless attacks
- etc
Jerry,
Did you ever think you would be an ardent supporter of someone with this record?
Not to mention someone with so many Pants on Fire Comments.
This idea of tribalism as the source of all evils is interesting. In this case, it's a way of avoiding dealing with issue of unfitness of Donald Trump to be president. Opposition to Trump isn't because the guy is unfit, rather it's because he is a Republican, so all the problems specific to Trump magically disappear. voila!
I must say, I have asked myself the questions Trump raises for Republicans. If my party nominated someone who clearly was unfit for the presidency, what would I do? Would I be tribal? Would I support him because he was a member of my tribe? Would I duck the issue as so many Republicans did during the last election? Or would I have the courage to oppose and campaign my tribe's unfit nominee? I confess, quite frankly, I don't have any easy answers. They involve moral choices which, unlike Republicans, I have never had to make.
--Hiram
Hiram,
"Unfitness" is definitely an interesting concept.
Though I see Trump as being pretty much the opposite of everything I would want in a business partner, son-in-law, etc...
He has been fighting some problems that really needed fighting...
So I am not sure "unfit" is the correct word?
He has been fighting some problems that really needed fighting..
But does that have anything to do with fitness? Take China. Trump picked a fight with China. But what's his strategy? Trump withdrew from the trade alliance intended combat China's predatory trade practices, resulting in the isolation of the United States, pretty much ensuring his preferred policy of sanctions would have no effect.
Trump promised that only he could get things done, yet now in office, his choice of tactics seems intended to do the opposite. You get things done in Washington by making tough, and often politically damaging compromises. You reach out to the other side. Has Trump done that? Or has he played and pandered to his base which however undeplorable they may be, wasn't even large enough to win the popular vote let alone deliver the consensus any president needs to get things done.
--Hiram
I am a big Star Trek fan, and Trump reminds me of the actors on the show, as opposed to the characters they play. If you recall, the actors are always pressing buttons of some sort, often in ways that demonstrate considerable charisma and panache. But early on in the show, they learn something very important. They learn that while the buttons are well designed with state of the art graphics, and are very pretty, none of them are connected to anything at all.
Trump, like any good con man, is immensely skilled at pressing people's buttons. Like those actors on Trek, throughout his life he has put on a good show. His presentation of fighting would be the envy of James T. Kirk. But none of it has ever been connected to anything except the commercials.
--Hiram
Take the wall. Fight is "fighting" for the wall. But just because he is fighting for it, doesn't mean he has a strategy for getting it. Which he isn't.
Early on in his administration, Democrats offered him a deal, one that he seemed to favor. Basically, it exchanged more favorable treatment of DACA kids in exchange for some money for the wall. Now bear in mind, Democrats were offering something he was on record as being in favor of. He quite specifically has talked about how he loved the DACA kids. And he wanted the money for a wall. Accepting that deal would have been a fulfillment of the promise Trump campaigned on that only he could get things done. But ultimately rejected that deal for the reason why things don't get done, because he couldn't round up sufficient support within his own party to make the deal.
A willingness to fight makes no difference without a strategy to win. And Trump is incapable of forming such a strategy, which is why he is being played for a fool both foreign and domestically.
Anybody catch that video of Russian troops gloating over the half eaten meals Americans left behind in their hurry to keep Trump's commitment to abandon our allies? And Trump claims the world in laughing at him?
--Hiram
Trump offered amnesty for TWICE the DACA kids the Dems demanded, in exchange for wall funding, but they surprisingly refused because they did NOT want Trump to build the wall. That's not compromise; that's hyper-partisan obstinancy and we've seen nothing else since. Specifics matter.
If I were in the business of making ISIS videos, I would make one juxtaposing the tanks next to the Lincoln Memorial, with the one with the Russians chuckling over the Coca Cola.
--HIram
Real time account of Trump DACA deal. https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/why-trump-isnt-taking-democrats-offer-for-a-wall/
--Hiram
Hiram,
I do agree that Trump's methods and deal making skills are weak.
However he did get some money for the wall and worked with Mexico to stem the flow of refugees and asylum seeks. Which I think was the primary goal.
And yes his handling of Syria has been a complete disaster. But if he does seek to boost the standing of Putin, it was a huge success.
Jerry,
There were a lot of good options for getting wall money. Unfortunately Trump over played his hand to make his Far Righters happy.
538 Why Trump Did Not Make Deal
Russian Syria Video
TRump was on record as supporting two things, DACA immigrants, and the border wall. Despite getting yes on both from Democrats he wasn't able to negotiate a deal for either.
Master negotiator at work.
By the way, after selling out our allies, according to morning news report, Erdogan is refusing to meet with the vice president and secretary of state, insisting that Trump visit Ankara where his surrender can be abject. Only then, will our national humiliation be complete.
--Hiram
Apparently Erdogan thought better of his hasty statement
There is no point in humiliating Trump too much. Even Trump deserves a shred of dignity.
--Hiram
Post a Comment