- Why shut down State Parks on the one week/weekend when User Fees probably exceed actual cost?
- Why the delay in keeping the Zoo open? You are continuing to feed the animals anyway...
- Do more things become Critical the longer the State is shutdown?
- Why are Politicians given the choice regarding turning down their salary? Shouldn't that have been one of the first things cut?
Star Tribune Same gulf divides
Star Tribune What's Open/Closed?
Star Tribune MN Zoo Open
Star Tribune More Things Critical
MinnPost Impact on Non-Profits
Forbes MN Gov't Shutdown
MinnPost Soving Shutdown
CBS News MN Shutdown Commentary
14 comments:
I forgot to mention... Isn't it cool that MN is getting so much National News attention? You would almost think we were "Wisconsin"...
your blog has grown quite quiet lately. I guess you and others have the good sense to get out and enjoy the summer. I think the legislature failing to do its job should have resulted in a much harder shutdown, though being a very empathetic person I am disagreeing with myself even as I type. The politicians should not only lose their salary, how about triggering a special election to let voters a fresh chance to weigh in on the impasse. I am sure that would cost a great deal of money, but perhaps such a law would have prevented this very costly shutdown.
So how about a making a comment or post regarding your thoughts on the current state of affairs in MN, and not mostly questions. I have always found your viewpoint, which I consider a that of a rational radical, very interesting. Right now I am inferring that you are mostly indifferent.
Laurie,
I'm thinking most everyone is indifferent to the shutdown except those waiting for a check from the government... Or possibly a license, camp site, etc.
Since I am not waiting for anything at this time... Let them stay shutdown for a few more months... I think my next tabs are due in Sept.
The most depressing thing about the shutdown is that the silly politicians will likely retroactively pay these State employees for sitting on their butts during a beautiful MN July. Tough time for a vacation in MN.
As for blogging effort in June/July... After a few yrs in the business I figured out it is not worth too much time. Most wise people are out enjoying the beautiful weather, so hits are way down.
I think my next post will be regarding the MN Budget Project graph you linked to. Still seems funny to me. SG Worst Case Scenario
As for my Spring/Summer, I'll post some pics soon. Here is the intro:
- Rr garage dr & parking spot
- Circular paver patio
- Boat: Fiberglass repair
- Boat Lift: Disassembly/assembly
The upside... I have had a chance to learn all about shoveling dirt, shoveling sand/gravel, setting retaining walls, setting paver blocks, planting flowers, landscaping, using resins, reinforcing w/ fiberglass,
etc.
It has been a crazy May/June... Hopefully July will settle down somewhat...
By the way, the back storage driveway is useable, the back patio is finished, and the boat is back on the lake and being used... Yipppeeee!!!
John,
you really minimize the impact of a shutdown on thousands of people and the state in general.
Minnesota government shutdown will slowly take toll on state's bottom line
You seem more radical than rational on this. I have also been attempting to understand the GOP/conservative base's refusal to compromise, that 200 year old American tradition where both sides get something and both sides give up something.
http://motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2011/07/all-modern-politics-one-chart
How does a government function with out compromise?
A $35.5 billion dollar budget would still result in real cuts to the size of government, though I think many GOP legislators believe their own spin on the budget numbers. What do you think about the GOP insistance that moderate legislators toe the party line?
How and when do you foresee the shut down ending?
COMPROMISE is an interesting word.
Let's say you have $10,000 CASH to buy a car with. The Dealer wants $13,000 for the car that you think is worth $10,000. Then the Dealer says let's COMPROMISE at $11,500.
By your argument, this would make a great deal of sense and you should grab it quickly. I mean you gave an extra $1,500 and the dealer gave up $1,500. Seems fair right...
Now let's say you make this wise and fair COMPROMISE every other year for 20 yrs as you change out cars. This means that you have paid ~$1,500 more per car than you thought they were worth a total of 10 times.
And since this was more than the cash you had available. You are now carrying $15,000 in debt. And paying ~$800/yr in interest.
With the benefit of hindsight, should you have COMPROMISED, demanded more for your $10,000, lowered your expectations to be in alignment with a $10,000 car, or just walked away from the deal?
I am not sure how it will turn out... But at some point we have to become more reliant on ourselves and less reliant on this thing called "Government".
And if the Liberals feel bad for the "needy", there are plenty of non-governmental charities that will accept their money and time. Now are they willing to give themselves, or are they only happy when they give from someone elses wallet? Or better yet, receive from someone else's wallet?
On second thought, I think the GOP will end up giving in. There are simply too many citizens on the dole, thus they get their way in a democracy. This is how we ended up with the extremely large National Debt.
Rememember one of my favorite quotes by Ben Franklin: "When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic."
A few more interesting quotes.
Quote Garden Taxes
I get very frustrated when anybody suggests anything approaching that the legislature "failed to do its job." The only failure here is Gov. Dayton. He started planning this shutdown back in January, failed to present a workable budget himself, did everything he could to prevent the legislature from getting their job done – withholding information and sulking on the sidelines of negotiation – and finally vetoed everything after it was too late for the legislature to do anything different. Since then he has refused to call a special session, refused to consider a "lights on Bill," and engaged in an expensive and deceitful campaign to pin all the blame on Republicans. It is obvious that his intention was to create maximum pain for Minnesotans, but fortunately the courts have largely thwarted that.
It's silly! (and serious) Just look at what the Gov. has closed: state parks over the Fourth of July weekend when they easily would have paid for themselves in fees; the state lottery, which is almost pure revenue for the state; rest areas, which will have the effect of putting sleepy drivers out on the road and endangering innocents; and license bureaus, another moneymaker.
Not only did he shut down the parks and rest areas, he actually PAID state employees to go out and push people out of the parks and block off the rest areas! This is not somebody trying to save a few bucks because the spending authority isn't there. This is a petulant child acting out, spending more and taking in less than the State would have under the Republican budget.
My hope is that people start ignoring this government shutdown. If you need a license for something and can't get it, do it anyway. If you can get into a rest area or state Park, go ahead and use it – you paid for it. If the Capitol lawn needs mowing, go mow it, and if you want to pick up trash beside the road on your adopted highway, I will wager that you can find a way to dispose of the trash that does not require state employees. That's really our only hope unless the idiot-in-charge somehow comes to his senses.
J. Ewing
The FDR quote remains my favorite:
Taxes, after all, are dues that we pay for the privileges of membership in an organized society.
Though I will say I have become slightly more conservative, perhaps due in part to the influence of your blog.
At this point I would be fine with what would appear to many liberals as a very lopsided compromise to end the shutdown. Dayton just needs to be offered something that does not involve a complete capitulation of what he campaigned on. Hopefully if this offer comes he is smart enough to take it.
I think I have become bored enough with the shutdown to refocus my political attention to the much more significant stalemate in DC over the debt ceiling. It is my understanding that a lack of compromise on this could really tank the economy. I have been thinking the banksters and chamber of commerce may demand a deal.
What I really need to do is focus my attention on work. I have to teach kindergarten summer school starting tomorrow.
J,
It was interesting reading through your alternate universe to my point of view, though I won't claim I tried too hard to understand it.
It's clear that you believe the GOP is 100% correct in its position and Dayton is 100% to blame. In my estimation the GOP gets nearly all the blame for the shutdown, with an allowance that there is perhaps some way Dayton could have negotiated more effectively, though I can't see what it is.
I am willing to settle for that lopsided compromise I mentioned previously, because the GOP legislators are so wedded to their #'s and their principles that to hold out for more would truly be a disaster for the state.
I do get that the conservatives are determined to make real cuts to govt and if I didn't know it would be a complete waste of time I might try to make the case that a 35.5 billion dollar budget is a real cut and a reasonable compromise.
So if you are willing to concede that a functioning government involves compromise Dayton needs to get something. Maybe you could explain what that is in the GOP proposal.
Now c'mon Laurie, I go through all that trouble talking about cars and dealers.... And you don't even weigh in on what the car buyer should do...
You definitely need to move over to one of those traditional Public Schools... I mean a Teacher working in July, what is this world coming to?
If it makes you feel any better. I have just put in a few hours tonight myself... The upside is that I can do it in front of the music video channel with my feet up. Just got done, now it is time to wind down.
I read through your car story, John, and had the reaction flawed analogy, though it does have some salient points. In the interest of procrastinating more on what I still need to do, I will attempt to amend your story.
Your wife is relevant in this situation, and she has her heart set on a more expensive model, with safety features she deems essential. The dealer's firm asking price on this is $13,000. You know this because you walked out on negotiations and have been taking the bus for a week. Now you could stick with your $10,000 and not a penny more position on the car purchase, but your wife will not cosign on the loan (cash does not work for this aspect of my story, but both cars are a reasonable fit within your budget.) Your wife has agreed to forego the sunroof, but continues to insist on side airbags and GPS. The model she is now pushing for costs $11,500. So what are you going to do? Continue to take the bus and sleep on the couch for many weeks until she agrees to your demand? The kids are getting frustrated and starting to complain quite a bit. One has lost his job because he can't get to work.
Also, remember you do have to work with your wife next year on that big home remodeling project that you have putting off for so long. (I especially like this part of my story as it alludes to the major reforms needed in state govt that legislators(and Dayton) need to deal with - the Strib had a good editorial on this today.) Thoughts on my totally different direction on what's most relevant in this impasse?
About numbers in your car story. I can't really respond to them with in a framework of an analogy, but maybe it is worth considering in real terms. The facts that I think I could find won't persuade J Ewing a bit, but your take could be interesting.
Perhaps if I put the analogy in more blunt terms, Laurie, it will make sense to you. One side of this debate came into it wanting to spend no more than was spent last year. When a ton of new money was projected to come in, they agreed to spend that, too. The other side of the debate wants to spend even more money, which we do not have and cannot get, and on some unspecified "good." Which is more reasonable?
Back to the car analogy, the Governor is the wife who not only wants the more expensive car, will not accept one just as good (or better) that you can afford, and then SABOTAGES the one you already have!
J. Ewing
Something else needs to be said, apparently. This "$5 Billion deficit" is a complete fiction, based on what Democrats in the last session WANTED to spend. The actual amount SPENT was about $30B plus about $1B of one-time federal "stimulus" money (put on your kindergarteners' credit cards). Therefore, if the legislature wants to spend $34B, they could be accused of spending like drunken sailors themselves. That Dayton wants to spend still more ought to qualify him for immediate rehab.
And I try not to get into people's motivations, because their actions are debatable without that information. But it seems to me that Dayton's insistence on a tax hike is just for the sake of a tax hike, not because State government NEEDS more money to spend.
The growth of state spending is unsustainable, meaning we have to stop spending more and more. What part of impossible does the Gov. not understand? Oh, and BTW, he has been planning for this shutdown since January-- documented fact.
J. Ewing
Here's my favorite FDR quote;
"The process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service. the employer is the whole people, who speak by means of laws enacted by their representatives in Congress."
John,
Writing my car shopping analogy motivated me to think a bit more on your story, which is really very straight forward. You should go to other dealers to get the very best car/deal you can, staying firmly within your $10,000 cash budget.
Now that answer is so boring I am going to stretch car buying into another analogy about govt, because they are fun to write. This one requires a bit of explanation/set up. It reflects my understanding of the conservative pt. of view.
Let's say the dealer represents the DFL who has been in control of all branches of govt for many years, the car represents the totality of govt. and you represent the taxpayers.
When you set out to purchase that $10,000 car with cash you are completely screwed. Let me explain the ways. First there is only one dealer in town which offers only over priced luxury models. You have tried for years to advise them how to get major inefficiencies out of their business to bring down the price significantly, but have been completely ignored. What's worse is each year the car gets bigger, more luxurious, and much more expensive. There is no way you can afford it without going deeply into debt.
At this point you have decided to forego the car and just walk or ride your bike. Sorry, you now risk being thrown in jail, as it has been mandated that all workers must purchase. So being a responsible person who is not yet ready to shoot the dealer, you very reluctantly send in your exorbitant payments each month. You also reluctantly drive around all the non car owners to their medical and other appointments, which has also been mandated.
So how did I do? Feel free to add to or change parts of my story to make it a more true representation.
I hope people have not become too bored with or confused by my analogies, as I have a bit to add /change to my previous one, to include what I view as a couple more significant details.
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